New Dry Suit and Wet Suit Requirements

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New Dry Suit and Wet Suit Requirements

(20 posts) (11 voices)

Started 6 years ago by Chief
Latest reply from Chief

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Chief
Coastal Vagabond

I have found a new product that may solve some of the issues that have been coming up in recent years regarding the drysuit requirement for SUPs and wind surfers and a few others. This rule modification is temporary and experimental. If things work out, it will become permanent.

Note that you can still use a dry suit with suitable insulation layers. In fact, it is still the recommended approach if you have any kind of open boat.

But several people have asked why they cannot use a wet suit. They use it all the time so why not during a challenge. The answer is conductive heat loss and chafing when worn in wind and for 16 hours or more per day.

But there is a somewhat new product that can fix that. Checkout http://sharkskin.com.au/ . This suit can be worn by itself, under a wet suit, under a dry suit or under any kind of foul weather gear. It solves all the problems with a standard wet suit and seems very affordable.

The combination of a Shark Skin and a wet suit or dry suit or paddling pants and jacket will meet the requirements for the Florida events.

I should have mine for the Hobie Sailing Meetup this Saturday.

Posted 6 years ago #
Bacon
Member

Looks like a great product. I think there may be something very similar out in the US called Lavacore. It seems to be made the same with the multiple layers.

https://www.lavacoreinternational.com/

Posted 6 years ago #
ZeroTheHero
Member

just to ad my 2 cents. I know a drysuit is a big expense and is bulky to carry on board. I also know in '13 and '14 I used my drysuit. Both times were in class 4 boats too. I know many feel it's apia but wouldn't you rather have the suit and not need it, than be too cold to carry on? If this product above really does it all I guess that works. I like knowing I can be dry and warm

Posted 6 years ago #
Cwolfe
Member

Seems to me to be premature to change rules and adapt them to a specific name brand product. Drysuits seem to be the standard for cold water immersion risk and have a proven record. Although sharkskin might be the cat's meow and captain's may chose to wear them, an event like the EC should not be quick to jump on the bandwagon.

There is no drysuit rule for a kayak or a kruger seawind but I had one in 2013 and was glad I did. I am from Minnesota and cold water is the standard up here. However, I have been a wee bit chilly on a couple ECs. Full blown shivering in 2013 on the first night. Thankful for my drysuit and a couple bags of "sport beans" to get my energy up enough to generate heat. Either my drysuit or a drytop and bottoms will be traveling with me around Florida this year.

Cwolfe

Posted 6 years ago #
KnotSynced
Member

Chillcheater, NRS and Kokatat also market products that fill this niche. They all have advantages and disadvantages. I am really curious to see how Sharkskin stacks up. I may buy a top to compare it to my NRS hydroskin.

Posted 6 years ago #
SwampMonkee
Member

So if I understand correctly, the rule now is either 1. a drysuit or 2. A wetsuit with a sharkskin base layer of specifically "sharkskin".

Is this what you are saying?

Posted 6 years ago #
Chief
Coastal Vagabond

In my previous message I did not mean to imply that Shark Skin is the only product that will be accepted. I am sure that there are other products out there that are doing similar things. I do suggest you look at the shark skin web site to see the sort of solution I am looking for.

Via email I received a heads up about Lava Core and Hyperflex wet suits. These are also interesting. I will try to find a local dealer so I can check them out.

In this thread other manufacturers have been mentioned that provide the same benefits

One final note: Although Shark Skin (and other products) might be all you need during the challenge, you must have an outer layer as well that you bring along. The difference is that the outer layer does not have to be a dry suit. A foul weather outer layer is still required. A really cheap and light weight option might be Frogg Toggs. A higher price outer layer might be something from Kokotat like my farmer john and storm cag.

Posted 6 years ago #
Chief
Coastal Vagabond

I don't think it is premature to allow the use of a new technology that has been out for a few years and is recommended by several WaterTribers with experience in the type of boats that these suits are intended for - namely open boats like SUPs and wind surfers. I would also include sit-on-tops.

Althought dry suits are still recommended, they do have certain drawbacks. Florida in March is sort of unique because we can have very cold, nasty weather and wonderful very hot weather. The water can range from 50 or less near Tampa to 70 or more in the Keys. So the dry suit is great in foul weather and not so great in good weather as you move south.

As I said above, I did not mean to say that only one product would do. There are many products that can be used for this purpose. And you still need an outer layer. These products serve the purpose of providing an insulation layer intended for wet environments and for much of the time can be used without the outer layer.

I am keeping my Kokatat farmer john and storm cag. I am adding an inner layer of Shark Skin or one of the other products after I get a good look at them.

Posted 6 years ago #
Chief
Coastal Vagabond
OK, Lava Core also works. Note that with both of these product lines there are many selections. Choose wisely. Remember, they are insulation layers that can double as single layer solutions when conditions are within their limits. You still need an outer layer.

Locally
- Lava Core is at Tackle Shack and they have 40% of remaining stock.
- Shark Skin is at Bill Jackson's. I don't know if they have any specials
Both have scuba diving oriented products and water sports oriented products. For our purposes I am sticking with the water sports oriented products along with my Kokatat farmer john and storm cag. Others might prefer a farmer john wet suit for an outer layer and a shell jacket of some kind.

I saw a really great hat from Lava Core too.
Posted 6 years ago #
Bermudaboy
Member

Two questions if anone can help or has already found...

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Sharkskin Men's Chillproof Undergarment With Front Zip

<font face="Arial">1) weight of garment ?

<font face="Arial">2) are arms are designed for at-sides: diver/snorkler or multipurpose mobility

Posted 6 years ago #
BeastOarman
Member

I went with the SharkSkin Performance Wear Pro because it seemed to offer better mobility (probably less warmth). On sale for $97.46 at scuba.com, will let you know what it is like after I try it.

I plan to still bring my drysuit.

Posted 6 years ago #
SwampMonkee
Member

Back to drysuits I have been a big fan of Stohlquist products. I had my first suit 8 years and now my second for the last 2. Their warranty service has been great. When my first suit finally wore out and could no longer be repaired they sold me a new one of my choice at about 40% off. Anyway if I were buying a new suit now I would probably do this one, very unique:

http://stohlquist.shptron.com/p/shift-drysuit?pp=12

Good videos here:

http://www.stohlquist.com/apparel/drysuits/shift.html

It's the Shift and has a very unique outter jacket and venting system.

Posted 6 years ago #
SeaDawg
Member

SM

The Shift is a nicely designed suit. From the demo model that I got to use for a bit I found it had too many features (neoprene pockets, smartphone pocket with cord pass through, double tunnel + full jacket) which added more bulk than I found comfortable, wearing my pfd over top of it. I could see how it would be excellent with an inflatable horseshoe style pfd on an open deck rather than sitting in a cockpited kayak.

I'm looking forward to the new Kokatat Radius suit which should be here in about two weeks. It takes the Switch Zip pants/top design from the whitewater style Idol drysuit and incorporates it into the sea kayaking Expedition suit. This allows it to be a complete drysuit or a standalone drytop. Once my personal suit comes in with the rest of the stock I'll put up a video review of it. Provided there's still some liquid water to jump into here.

SeaDawg

Posted 6 years ago #
Bermudaboy
Member

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Headin to lake, looks like we going to get 15-20knts, an 48F, but sunshine, wanna test inner layering today, in past finding right combination has been problem, warm enough but not sweating (kokokatat) ... SDR, I will also be trying out that weed fin that has never touched water... So much for watching football....

Posted 6 years ago #
Bermudaboy
Member

48f 15-25 wind, continuous broad reach planing 4hrs, marino thin underwater,flecce upper,thick wool socks. Underlayers all soaked in sweat at end. Not dripping but saturated....hmmm what to do...
I
Am. I

Posted 6 years ago #
Bermudaboy
Member

Underwear...

Posted 6 years ago #
Coastie
Member

ClamCounter and I have worn the Kokatat Super Nova suit for the past four years. It has a relief zipper and socks with latex wrist gaskets. The neck fitting is more comfortable than most dry suits as it has a neoprene neck gasket in lieu of the traditional latex. The suit is very lightweight and comfortable, and you can layer up very easily. It is actually listed as a "paddling suit". It is certainly functional, as we were totally immersed when we flipped the Miss Marie in EC2013 about 6 miles offshore north of Venice Inlet. We were probably in the water for 10 or 15 minutes before we righted the boat. I think we paid about $450 or $500 four years ago.

Posted 6 years ago #
BeastOarman
Member

BeastOarman wrote:

I went with the SharkSkin Performance Wear Pro because it seemed to offer better mobility (probably less warmth). On sale for $97.46 at scuba.com, will let you know what it is like after I try it.

I plan to still bring my drysuit.

OK, so I have been using this shirt about a month but that is only a half dozen times due to the ice. Anyway, it is a pretty impressive shirt. It is a compression shirt, which is said to reduce fatigue - for me, it means I have to wear something over it so I don't scare people. The interesting thing, of course, is the way the fabric works. I wear it under my drysuit. I have been using it as a base layer most days, then by itself when it got around 30 degrees. It is very comfortable, when cold or as it heats up (above 50 today). It is also amazing at wicking. I get back from my rows and feel totally dry on top, and practically have to wring out my long underwear! The shirt becomes wet too, but on the outside.

As for wind resistance - not really, at least not the one I had. This morning at 37 degrees, I had to flip my drysuit top on while prepping the boat.

I have no idea how it is in the water, sorry guys, not jumping in without my drysuit while it is still winter in Connecticut. All in all, I think for me it will be a good Spring/Fall shirt, and good under the drysuit in winter. But not seeing it as comparable to a drysuit for safety up North.

Posted 6 years ago #
Clewless
Member

After 5 years in a kayak I switched to a Hobie TI this year. I read everything about outerwear options in this and a couple of other threads. For the event we went with layers of Lavacore and Sharkskin type products under Froggtogg bibs and fairly heavy paddling jackets. Even though it was a cool year, this set up worked and kept us appropriatly warm. That being said, if I use this boat again I will get a full drysuit. We were wet to the core the entire time. The under layers kept us warm, and the outer layers gave protection from the wind, but we would have been far more comfortable if we had been dry underneath. Setting up camp would also have been much easier if we could have just shed the drysuits instead of setting up tents in wet gear before being able to change to sacrosant camp clothes.

Posted 4 years ago #
Chief
Coastal Vagabond

Some people use Lavacore or Sharkskin as a first layer and then put a dry suit or dry bib with jacket over that. The benefit is that if you end up in the water, the Lavacore or Sharkskin will work even if your outer layer gets flooded.

I like to use my Kokatat dry suit bib with a Mysterioso first layer. I've been thinking about switching to Lavacore or Sharkskin for a first layer. But Mysterioso works really well. It will also work (somewhat) if your suit gets flooded.

The great thing about using Mysterioso as a first layer with a dry suit bib as outer layer is not having to change clothes when making camp. Just take off the outer layer and sleep in the first layer which normally will be dry. It's a lot warmer than changing out of wet clothes when the wind is howling and it's 40 degrees like it was Saturday night. Leave the sacrosanct clothes in their double waterproof bags.

For a jacket I use a Storm Cag. There are jackets available that will link to the bib, but I like the Storm Cag because I can put it on at any time and it fits over my lifejacket which means I don't have to take off my lifejacket to put on a waterproof layer when needed.

Posted 4 years ago #

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