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Need WaterTribe Veteran Advice

(14 posts) (10 voices)

Started 1 year ago by NativeSon
Latest reply from kayakman7

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NativeSon
Member

Hello Tribe,

I need some input from the veteran WaterTribe kayakers. (actually, all Tribers) I am having difficulty finding a kayak that fits me, and meets the needs of doing a challenge which is my goal. I have a Seda Viking, an older 1990 model, and have enjoyed that for the last 10 years. Very stable kayak, but not enough storage for a longer challenge. Here is my story:

I bought a Current Designs Solstice GTS. Awesome paddling kayak, and very fast. The cockpit opening is very small. I am not a really big guy, but am 6’2” and 190, and had great difficulty getting in and out without dumping. Had a rudder, never had a kayak with a rudder so had challenges there too. Stability was a challenge as it’s a very narrow kayak. Sold!

I bought a Current Designs Gulfstream. Again, a great paddling kayak, fast but not as fast as the Solstice. The cockpit was a bit larger than the Solstice so entry and exit was better, but could never get the seating system to my comfort level and the cockpit opening was still too tight. Has a deployable skeg which was great for tracking. Sold!

Now I have a Seda Glider. A great paddling kayak, cockpit opening is the same as the Viking so entry and exit is no problem. Has a rudder. My challenge with this one is the stability and the rudder. I have concluded I don’t like having to mess with a rudder. I have also concluded that if I am not comfortable with the stability, it won’t work. Still have Glider, but will likely be on the block soon.

My questions to the Tribe are:

What Kayaks types are big enough for a challenge yet have the width for stability? (I realize I will give up speed for stability)

Do you really think a rudder is a must? (Don’t have a sail and don’t intend to have one)

Any other advice on kayaks with a larger cockpit opening, good stability, and enough storage for a challenge?

Thank you! NativeSon/Ken

Posted 1 year ago #
stripbuilder
Member

You ride in a boat and you wear a kayak, therefore, you have to have one that comfortably fits you. You must be comfortable with the cockpit fit and the stability for a challenge. I would demo and paddle every kayak possible till you find the right one. Seating systems can be changed and altered to fit you. I did my first EC and NCC in a kayak without a rudder or skeg, but this year I had a rudder which definitely makes it easier. Most sea kayaks have enough storage for a challenge. Our problem is that we tend take way more with us than we need. JC

Posted 1 year ago #
RubberDucky
Member

I've been moving the other direction, from ultra-stable folding kayaks to a Gulfstream and next to a 20" wide boat. It takes a fair amount of time in a "tippier" boat to get comfortable but then the payoff in speed & efficiency is great. The Gulfstream seemed as stable as a rock during the 2010 EC but also was very slow, getting knocked around by the waves and bobbing over them, instead of punching through. You should try adding a full touring load, or some sand bags for ballast... will make a huge difference.

If you really want something stable and with a large cockpit try a folding boat, such as a Klepper, or a Kruger...

Posted 1 year ago #
DaveOnCudjoe
Member

We sure see a lot of Krugers year after year. Dave

Posted 1 year ago #
Uthred
Member

Hello, sounds like you need to be krugerized. I would not give up the rudder, there are lots of Kruger tales on this forum. I have the opposite problem where as I am 5'6" it's a bit big for me. I have been going back and forth on selling - though giving up a kayak I can sleep in is not easy

Posted 1 year ago #
NativeSon
Member

Thank you Tribe! I knew I could get some good feedback from you guys. I have been getting a bit frustrated with it and trying to stay patient. I experienced the same thing with the Gulfstream, an awesome boat but a little slower. I've never been in a Kruger and have been hesitant because it's called a "canoe". (OK, just asked for a tongue lashing from the Kruger Gang, go for it!)

Until the first EC I watched, I had never heard of Kruger. Guess I need to give them a go. I've decided to keep paddling the Glider and see if I can get more comfortable. The Glider is an awesome boat.

Please keep the feedback coming, I gain so much from you guys. And if anyone lives in the Tampa Bay area, has a Kruger and would be willing to swap boats for a pafddle, please let me know.

Thanks again Tribe!

NativeSon/Ken

Posted 1 year ago #
SailBirdMike
Member

One kayak that I've been considering for myself (remember, I sail more than I paddle, and I'm big) is the Eddyline Nighthawk 17.5 <font color="#0066cc">http://www.eddyline.com/kayak-models/night-hawk-17-5/ It's big, stable, a bit wide at 24.5", and has a nicely sized cockpit opening. It might be worth a look.

Another one would be the Pygmy Boats Borealis XL http://www.pygmyboats.com/boats/borealis-XL-kayak-kit.html Of course, you have to build it from a kit, but with all the modifications we tend to do, I often wonder if scratch built wouldn't be easier!

A QCC 500 http://www.qcckayaks.com/model.asp?model=q500x would be another choice, although I'm beginning to question QCC's build quality (the recent acquisition by Wenonah Canoe may either help or hurt, I'm not familiar enough with Wenonah to tell). It would have the smallest cockpit opening of the three listed here.

Note that I'm speaking from a suitability for body fitment category regarding these boats... our kayaking Tribers would be a better source of info as to whether either of these boats would make good Challenge vessels.

Posted 1 year ago #
Chief
Coastal Vagabond

Although the Kruger Canoes are exceptional for expedition paddling, they are very much different than a kayak. Maybe that is because they are actually canoes. The comfort factor goes way up but speed, at least for shorter trips, goes down. One way that I look at it is the you take care of a sea kayak, but a Kruger takes care of you. This is a major factor in long distance trips. Also you might find that the speed advantage for longer trips goes to the Kruger unless you are a stone cold crazy animal like SharkChow.

Most of the time you paddle a Kruger using a canoe paddle. You can use a double paddle, but this adds to your work load. A canoe paddle also keeps you dryer. Again these are small differences that add up to large differences over time. I use a canoe paddle virtually all the time, but I carry a double paddle as my spare. The double paddle is only used during surf launching or against high winds right on the nose. And of course the double paddle is part of my reentry system along with a paddle float.

I like both sea kayaks and Kruger Canoes. Currently I have a Viviane sea kayak and Kruger Dreamcatcher. You are welcome to borrow my Dreamcatcher for a few days to give it a good try. My Dreamcatcher is high volume and heavier than most because Verlen gave it an extra layer or two, but it will give you a good idea of how they fit.

Posted 1 year ago #
PaddleDancer
Member

Mike: I've paddled a Night Hawk for seven years. It was my first kayak and remains my favorite. I have the 16' but know the 17.5 has more room. IronBob is an Eddyline distributor if you have specific questions. (Contact him soon because he leaves for his year long 5,000 mile trek across South America next week.) I just sold my Eddyline Falcon...left my garage this morning. So, now I have room for something else on the rack in the garage. Something with a rudder!

Posted 1 year ago #
NativeSon
Member

Thanks again everyone! Good advice. I've looked at the Eddylines before, but at that time were a bit pricey for me. Now, I'm ready to do it right and will start to look at them again. I'll try to catch IronBob before he hits the trail.

Chief, do you live the Tampa area? Would like to give the Dreamcatcher a go. I am definitely not a sailor, so not interested in dealing with sails. I seem to recall your rig had sails. And even though I'm not real excited about the canoe paddle vs. the tandem-kayak paddle, I am intrigued by the Kruger mystique. Let me know where you are and if you'll be out for a day paddle somewhere soon.

Again thank you Tribe for the good feedback and please keep it coming.

NativeSon/Ken

Posted 1 year ago #
Chief
Coastal Vagabond

My Dreamcatcher is available so you can try it out. I will leave all the sailing stuff off the boat so it will be in paddle mode.

I have sent you an email.

Posted 1 year ago #
Jarhead
Member

I live on Davis Islands just below downtown Tampa. You (and anyone else) are welcome to paddle my Sea Wind most anytime. It is on the dock behind my house, so it's no trouble at all. I'm going to NC in a few days to do a little whitewater paddling, but email me off the forum and we can set something up.

Bill

Posted 1 year ago #
NativeSon
Member

Chief, I am having some challenges with my email, but will respond shortly. I had my Grandson's 1st birthday this weekend, and I leave this coming Saturday for vacation for a week. (a well needed break from work) It will be a few weeks before I can take you up the offer.

Bill, thanks for the offer. I may take you up on that, but as noted above will be a few weeks.

Regarding the Eddyline Night Hawk, I noticed on the Eddyline website that it weighs in around 60 lbs. The fiberglass kayaks I have had were much lighter. For anyone that has or had a night hawk, how was the extra weight as compared to a glass boat? I know I will lose a little speed, but is that a trade-off you have to accept for this boat?

Thanks, Ken

Posted 1 year ago #
kayakman7
Member

I like my Epic 18x, fast and comfortable. The integral rudder works well and there is a solid footrest to brace against. I'm 6'2" & 180 pounds and it's a great fit on me.
I know it's been used a lot in the EC, maybe someone who has used one could comment on how well they race.

Posted 1 year ago #

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