Minnesota Question number One - Bear Spray

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Minnesota Question number One - Bear Spray

(18 posts) (14 voices)

Started 2 weeks ago by ShartBait
Latest reply from Chief

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ShartBait
Member

I would say that a challenger would obviously be safer carrying bear spray on a 200 plus mile trip through the woods in Minnesota than not. In 2016 I noticed that some carried bear spray and others did not.

At a minimum of about 12 oz is this safeguard a no brainer to take or will the weight or some other reason mean you leave it at home?

In 2016 I put peanut butter on the back of chief's shirt and felt that gave me an edge when the bears showed up. However, one morning I caught Chief waxing my canoe - with honey.

Can you help me to understand the reasons that you will or will not be carrying bear spray?

Posted 2 weeks ago #
muddyfeet
Member

This area is home to scavanging black bears and not territorial grizzlys. Black bears will seek out your foodstuffs and other scented items, but will leave you alone unless those items are stashed in your tent at night. The reccomended way of dealing with a black bear in camp has been making noise and throwing rocks at it until it is annoyed and casually saunters off. My personal experience is that this works just fine. However, the thrill of such an incident does risk leaving a different kind of shartbait in your shorts. (awesome screenname, btw!)

They will bluff-charge you if they feel threatened. To my knowlege, there have been 2 incidents of black bears attacking people in the BWCA in the last 40 years, and no deaths have resulted (both sick/diseased black bears who were very emaciated). I have never carried bear spray in this area, and consider it non-essential. They are very shy critters and it is a treat to see one out there- unless it is carrying your food away.

I understand they prefer peanut butter on your partner versus honey, but there is also the old backup plan of just being able to run faster than your partner.

Posted 2 weeks ago #
Voyager
Member

Marcie and I carried it last year on our 1/2 Challenge from Moose L. I had bought it for an earlier summer trip through and around Agnes L. There were several complaints of a nusciance bear there. I'm not bringing it this year. I'd like to get the weight down. Usually the problem bears seem to always be in the same areas year after year. Around the southern edge of Lac Lacroix, Knife L. ( especially the S. Arm ), Ensign L,, Polly L., are a few prime examples. They're far enough out not to be hunted and yet in areas with lots of picknick baskets. I think traveling solo where one is quiet, with no smoke from a fire, and very little food odors to clue them in, MAY mean less risk. That's my game plan.

Posted 2 weeks ago #
Deerfly
Member

odds are overwhemingly in your favor of not having a dangerous encounter, however if you happen to be the lucky winner of that chance encounter that goes bad be prepared to get an ass whipping like you've never had...

Posted 2 weeks ago #
BeaV
Member

When trying to pack light... it's unnecessary weight IMHO.

Besides, bear tastes good and too much pepper would ruin the flavor.

Posted 2 weeks ago #
ShartBait
Member

I had my card lying face down this whole time. Just turned it over and it says, "Don't take bear spray".

Thankfully my game of Cards Against Bears aligns with the expert opinion. And yes, I know I sound more and more like BermudaBoy with every post.

Thank you all for the input regarding almost a pound of weight. I'm a little surprised that no one mentioned that annoying noise that a can of bear spray clanking against your rifle makes. It can get so annoying.

So, hang your food supply from a tree or sleep with it in or near your tent/tarp/hammock?

On my maiden voyage I think everyone stored their food and snacks with them in their shelters.

I've read conflicting advice on the topic of safeguarding your food from bears.

What do you plan to do and why?

Posted 2 weeks ago #
Bermudaboy
Member

SB, my spray on my pfd, slighly larger than a pen.. & ony a few ounces. makes me feel whole lot better than theory 101 on bears taste in tribers when this little movie scene plays in my head as twigs snap in the darkness around my tent.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0AHvPpGrDU

Posted 2 weeks ago #
CrazyRussian
Member

Sorry guys, I couldn’t resist.
https://youtu.be/nU5cMZymSr0

Posted 2 weeks ago #
JoeWildlife
Member

The best defense against any species of bear on the planet is a small .22 pistol. Just shoot your partner in the knee and move along, and you will be fine.

Posted 2 weeks ago #
Whitewolf
Member

Done 60 or so open water camping trips in the BWCA/Q over the last 25 years and seen one bear in that time from the canoe climbing down a tree. On something like this you shouldn't have time to be concernced about bears. If you do- you spedning too much time on shore. But as long as were talking food agents to throw off a hungry bear; bacon grease rubbed into your partners shirt he just cleaned fish in works every time!!!

Posted 2 weeks ago #
BeaV
Member

ShartBait,

Somewhere hidden in all that humor, I found your question....three options the way I see it.

1) hang your food pack up in a tree. Said tree needs to be a big tree with a big horizontal branch up about 14-18 feet above ground level. The food pack needs to be away from the trunk of the tree by at least 5 feet, below the limb by 4 feet, and above the ground by 8 feet. This is the best method and the one recommended by the US Forest Service. Problem is, not every campsite has one of these hanging trees, especially when near the Ely area where a giant wind storm in 1999 blew down almost all the big trees or when you get in the burn area between Saganaga to Gunflint Lakes where stuff got burned. Nother problem is that us folks will be tired of paddling when we start looking for a site and don't have the extra time/strength to waste going site to site looking for a hanging tree.

2) the latest fad is to hide your food from the bears by stashing it away from the camp. This has a little merit if you use those Bear Vaults that help seal in the odors and bears can't break into. Problem is hiding food from a bear is akin to hiding a throw-toy from your Labrador Retriever. And when (if) they find it, you won't know about it till you wake up and and try to retrieve your stash. Food gone and Challenge over!

3) if I get lucky and land in a campsite with a suitable tree, I'll hang. I will have my food in a 30 liter "blue barrel" that helps keep a little of the food odors contained and will take some doing for a bear to rip into it. If there is no suitable hanging tree, I will leave the barrel outside my tent attaching it to my tent with a bungy with a quick clip. If a bear tries for my food, it will awaken me and I'll be able to defend my stuff. This is what I will do, not what I recommend for others. Many may find the thought of being suddenly awakened with the tent violently moving, getting out of sleeping bag, and facing a big critter face to jaws in the dark not too appealling. On second thought, "hey Whitewolf, can I attach our blue barrel to your tent?"

Any food pack left on the ground will also be fairgame to mice so a sealed plastic blue barrel or Bear Vault container is a plus (I don't like eating my trailmix after the mice have been in it). The mice are a bigger threat then the bears. As others have said above, problem bears are few and they tend to be in areas heavily visited by canoers. For us that means the area from Basswood Lake through Knife Lake (sorry this is within the blowdown area).

Posted 2 weeks ago #
Clewless
Member

Although I was born in Minnesota, everything I know about the Boundary Waters I learned either from BeaV, or along the way in the 2015 and 2016 Minnesota challenges, so I am no expert.

Mzee and I never saw a bear on either trip. We think we saw bear prints once, but that may have been wishful thinking for a better story. We did see beavers, otters, swans, bald eagles, loons, ducks, and a small Lynx.

Our food plan was fairly simple. In the morning, we made coffee and had a quick bite of something, but never really cooked anything. Lunch was informal snacking along the way. For dinner, we tried to always stop for a nice break in the late afternoon. That gave us a rest and a morale boost that transferred into more energetic paddling the last couple of hours of the day. The bonus of that plan was that we rarely cooked anything at our campsite. We certainly snacked etc in the evening, but nothing that sent the smell of cooking food off into the woods. We did not hang our food or use a food barrel. Around camp we kept all of our food in CampSource Odor-Barrier bags (Amazon). We also put all trash in those bags. At night those bags were packed inside our closed portage packs which we left outside of our tents but not far away. We had no issues with mice, bears, or any other pests. I don’t know if all that was all a sound plan or we were just lucky.

I did bring bear spray. While I’m sure it’s unnecessary, for me the comfort outweighed the extra weight. I plan to bring the same old unused can again this year, along with a small 1.5oz marine air horn.

We also brought TheHammer (my nephew Ricky). He generally didn’t bother setting up his tent and slept on the ground, and he was not very meticulous about keeping his food stash tidy and packed away. Mzee and I figured any bear issues would start with him, and cause enough commotion that we would wake up and have a chance to run away.

Posted 2 weeks ago #
GrandmaL
Member

I agree with BeaV but, I don't tie to my tent. Just set it a few feet away and put metal plates or something on it that will make noise when it is disturbed. Blue barrels work well. I have only had one bear in camp in all the years and trips I have made. I am guessing that MN Challengers will have more to think about than bears.

Posted 2 weeks ago #
Chekika
Member

I carried a can of bear spray on our 2 two-week kayaking trips in Alaska. We had a group of 6 on our first trip (5 women and me) in August. They were deathly frightened if we even saw old bear tracks. We saw no bears. I was disappointed at the lack of bear sightings. I scheduled the 2nd trip a week after Glacier Bay National Park opened. I think about June 7. The second trip was 2 men/2 women. We saw 4 grizzlies and a few black bears. One young grizzlie came into our camp area as we were setting up. We shouted, banged pans together and, after some hesitation, he dashed off...he maybe came back during the night, but only left tracks. I was a little miffed (privately) to learn that our partner couple began to put their tandem kayak in the water during that episode. They were behind us, so we did not see that.

I'm a bit nervous in bear country. Always carry bear spray, although we have never had a problem in the lower states. We used a Bear Vault for our food in Alaska, and, since we have a BV, we use it on some trips in the continental US.

BTW, black bears and grizzlies do not mingle...grizzlies kill the black bears. The grizzlies occupy the more desolate wilderness areas and black bears the less rugged, even rural areas.

Keith

PS Although the Rangers in Glacier Bay did not buy it, I had heard that bears do not attack people in groups of 4 or larger.

Posted 2 weeks ago #
JoeWildlife
Member

I agree with Beav. I've done 9 trips to BWCA and Quetico and never seen or had a problem with a bear. We keep a clean camp and at the end of the day all food goes into a 60L barrel sealed up. I also put a few pans on top of the barrel with the idea that I'm gonna defend my food. I don't subscribe to the idea of hiding the food pack and letting a bear find it to leave us 4 or 5 days into the backcountry with no food. Surviving on boiled fish doesn't sound too appealing to me!

The bears are more likely to hit your food pack when you leave it at one end of a portage anyway.

Good hanging trees are too hard to find.

I think a lot of the bear issues are in the past, when the parks were much more heavily used. Yes there may be a problem bear here or there but I think the parks deal with those when they can.

I find it odd the rules for dealing with fish carcasses. In Quetico, they tell you to clean them away from camp and deep six the remains or leave them on a rock for the eagles and seagulls to eat. I always try to clean fish on an island away from camp. It's not much of a hassle if you keep a fillet knife and ziplock bag in the tackle bag. In BWCA, they want you to bury the caracasses 200 yards from camp. I think that is a joke...trying to dig a hole is impossible in many places, digging that hole is an unecessary disturbance to the environment, and leaving fish guts anywhere near camp, 200 yards away or not, doesn't seem like a good idea.

Anyway, don't fear the bears. The mice are more likely to get into your food, as was said. That is the main reason I like to use the blue barrels.

Joe

Posted 1 week ago #
MrMako
Member

My son, Lars, went to the Philmont Scout Ranch a few years ago. On any night in the summer over several hundred Scoits are spread out in the back country. They spend 6 nights in Bear country and have refined their techniques on food vs. bears. Basically they tie the food in the trees AWAY from camp. A couple of finer points. Things we humans might not think of as bear attractants are: Tooth paste, Personal hygiene items, ( I think even wet film ). You don’t wear to bed the clothes you cooked or ate in. They even realize that something invariably will need to be hung up after the dinner. They call that the “oops bag”. Below is a copy and paste from their site:

Typically, all food other than the night’s dinner will go in the bear bags along with anything else that will not be needed until morning.
The oops bag typically has the night’s dinner, the cleaning supply bag, personal smellables, the first aid kit, and smellable water bottles (a water bottle that has ever had anything other than water in it).

Posted 1 week ago #
Chekika
Member

Philmont Ranch participnts have certainly had a fair number of bear attacks over the years.

I don't know if they have any bear spray policy,

Keith

Posted 1 week ago #
Chief
Coastal Vagabond

In 2016 I carried my KA-Bar knife and bear spray. I'll do the same this year. The system I use also has a practice can which should be used before the trip so you know what to expect if you have to use it.

All of my food is double sealed and/or freeze dried. All "cooking" is done in the bag and then the bag is burned. All other packaging used during the day is also burned. I keep my pack with all non smelly packaged food in the vestibule area of my tent.

I think the folks who camp for a few days and cook steaks and fish and other great smelling stuff have more to be concerned about.

Posted 3 days ago #

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