Talking About Adventure In Small Boats
Bones
Member
I am preparing to arm a 2017 AI for the EC but having a challenging time choosing between a Hook 4 requiring wiring and separate battery or one of the Garmin 78 series handheld with the tiny screen that has been so popular with Watertribers in the past.
Could use a serious reality check by experience Tribers.
Thanks in advance.
ZeroTheHero
Member
Okay, my 2 cents. I like the hand held. At night I wear it around my neck in a waterproof bag. That way I always have it. I dont like the tiny screen but I like the small size, that it is light, and simple to use. Anything wired into the boat is going to be heavier, exposed to the elements, and is not portable. I have done several class 4 ECs and am now going to be in a Hobie TI. The TI is extremely wet, and I have found that lines get tangled in the stock parts pretty easily. I am trying to reduce potential snag area, not create more. I think the amount of water that comes over a TI at speed is likely far more than the "waterproof" models can safely handle.
Bosun
Member
I agree with Zero! the advantages of small portability and commonly sourced AA batteries (I use the advanced lithium in both primary and backup units) wins over a hull mounted unit in my opinion. I use the GPS more for an odometer or track log until I get south of Marco. That is when the tide tables, the charts and the GPS get more important for me . I like that the Garmin has the tide tables onboard and that I could download multiple tracks with the HomePort software. I keep a laminated list of the different tracks that I can pick and choose from depending on weather and tides.
hope this helps
MicroTom
Key Master
I use a Garmin handheld. I have an older 62sc and a newer 78sc. The reason I use these devices is their ease of configuration using the Home Port app, ability to conver different file types to the Garmin format, quality of the Blue Charts, normal buttons and NO TOUCH DISPLAY, simple route display, following a previous track, and velocity made good (VMG). If you find a device that does those types of things for you then go for it.
MrMako
Member
Bones:
Good choice. Since we know the Achilles heel of the TI is being wet. Plus the Garmin will need to be fed fresh batteries after it dies at the absolutly worst time. Probably when you are tired, things are dark and there are shallows nearby. I would suggest to increase the water proofness.
I had vaccum packed small groups of batteries together. To keep mositure from getting to all of the batteries. What I did not take into consderation was my hands were wet and salty. Next year I will have tissue in the same container as the batteries to wipe my hands off. The waterproffness of hand held electronics is all based on the case and the o-ring around the battery compartment. Everytime you open it, you are taking a chance of getting salt inside. If you don't close it properly, like I did when I was in a hurry; the O-ring is useless. Now I spray in "Corrosion Block", to coat the boards and wiring. Plus, I slather Dielectric grease, where I can. Especially around the o-ring. I was concerned that the Corrosion Block would migrate to the back of the Screen and ruin it. So far it has not. That being said, I am careful to leave the unit face up for long periods.
Good Luck, see you on the beach!
ZeroTheHero
Member
there are tricks to increasing battery life on the Garmins. Set it up so the back light is dim for at night and have it so it "sleeps" (screen goes dark) at the minimal setting. You just hit any button to wake it up. If I am using the map screen I usually hit the + or -. It either zooms in one level or out one level. Helps keep your night vision sharp too. Just don't forget to zoom in to see detail. Last time Mistermoon and I ran up on a shoal near Pavilion Key because we were zoomed out to the point it didn't show. Just like Team Vestas in the last Volvo.
I also turn off the compass (it's only really useful when you are sitting still), use lithium batteries and be sure to set the system option for the battery type (it defaults to Alkaline batteries).
Bones wrote:
I am preparing to arm a 2017 AI for the EC but having a challenging time choosing between a Hook 4 requiring wiring and separate battery or one of the Garmin 78 series handheld with the tiny screen that has been so popular with Watertribers in the past.
Could use a serious reality check by experience Tribers.
Thanks in advance.
Bones,
Dropped by the forum to see what is up when I saw your post. Having a bit of a reputation for being hard on gear, I wanted to add a response.
As others stated go with the 7* series. The more complex and power hungry the set-up is the higher the probability of something breaking.
Failure points on the 7* series----On the 76 and 72 the battery door seals Garmin tight, but is not designed to be abused by being on the deck of a kayak. After having a GPS fail, I began laying a thin layer of di-electric grease along the edge of the door. This creates a bulletproof seal, but it does make getting the cover off harder. Second the old 72 and 76 had a four pin connection. After one EC, I managed to get enough salt water in there to rot one off. That was probably a cumulative failure. After that I gobbed some dielectric grease into the four pin and the mini-usb port that was on a later model.
Finally, having seen many GPS devices fail, it pays to carry a basic GPS as a spare. If you can, look on eBay or Craigslist for an old 72 or etrex. Load key waypoints into that device and carry it as a spare. Better to make an emergency landfall at night to dig out the spare GPS than to find yourself having to spend the night on Plover or some other speck of land.
SBG
Agree with SBG about carrying a backup GPS. Beware of differences between your primary and backup unit. For example, if you use routes, be advised that the older/different units often don't support as many route waypoints (legs), so if you have long routes and copy them to your backup, some of the points may be truncated without warning. A few tribers have learned this the hard way... If you only have a handful of waypoints it doesn't matter.
I use a 78sc as my primary and a plain 78 as my backup. Each is in their own Aquapak (with 2 spare batteries, a piece of cloth for dealing with moisture when changing batteries, and a desiccant packet). That way, when one GPS fails, or the batteries die, I just turn on and switch-over to the other GPS unit. I prefer this to changing batteries on the water.
If I had this to do over again, I would get two 78sc units for the primary and backup. The more advanced units (78sc and 78) let you share data/waypoints wirelessly which might be a godsend when you discover that you are missing something on one GPS and need to transfer it from the other, while on the water.
I'm a fan of bagging my GPS. FWIW, I have never had a failure, over many years, with any GPS stored in an Aquapac with a desiccant packet. This includes a 76 unit that got me around Icleand and Newfoundland by kayak. I bag my radio too. A bag can make it tough to read the GPS at times, but it beats a dead GPS. Of course electronics can die at any time, so you still need to have the tools and know how to navigate without the luxury of a GPS.
I have 2 Garmin 78sc units (one is my wife's, but I use it if she is not around.) For the last 10 years or more I have bagged my GPS units. I include 2 AA batteries in the bags, but nothing else including no drierite. If I were circumnavigating Iceland (I never will), or something, I might add drierite because condensation at low temperatures is huge. I put matching waypoints and routes on each unit. You must check each route on each unit and make sure it does indeed have the waypoints it should have.
I have never had a GPS have an electronic failure on the water. Of course, I run out of battery power (I do replace batteries on the water if necessary), but never an electronic failure.
Keith
BustedRudder
Member
I used to hate bagging a GPS because of condensation, In the UF I was down to 1 out of 3 78sc by Ft lauderdale. As my "backup" it was in a bag that I found on Amazon. CWolfe loaned me one of his 78sc units in Daytona beach which also had the same bag. I have never lost one since.
I have hated the 78sc for it absolutely terrible design when it comes to being "waterproof". It claims IPX7, but it is not suitable to be outside let alone on the deck of a kayak. Shame on Garmin for that.
That said, it has by far the best interface and featutres for me. Our household has standardized on them for the simple reason of knowing the interface so well it is second nature even when halucinating.
This case fits the 78sc so snugly there is no condensation. Tip: take the lanyard off the 78sc and put it in the case bottom end first. At $7.99 it is a steal.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IPWL1XU/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1.
BB,
It depends on the model you have. For example the GPSMap78s and 78sc allows you to share data wirelessly while the GPSMap78 does not. I'm not an expert on the Etrex. I had an Etrex but didn't like the operation of the thumb stick when the unit was in a bag, so changed to the GPSMap series. Otherwise, the specs of the newer Etrex units look very good, including the ability to share data wirelessly.
The new Garmin website makes it difficult to compare GPSMap models to Etrex since the GPSMap series is for "marine" use and the Etrex is for "trail" use.
A comparison of the Etrex models is at http://www.gpscentral.ca/products/garmin/etrexseriescomparison.htm.
Some of the older units have only 500 waypoints, 20 routes, while the newer models have 2000 waypoints, 200 routes, so if your primary and secondary are different models then you have to be careful when copying routes and waypoints to avoid truncation and other problems.
Greg
SardinianIslander
Member
Hi all,
I also wondered about how to manage the GPS when sailing with my AI. Though in my case i dont need to know my position, I appreciate to know other details such as my speed, the time, distance and headin to my destination and other destinations in the area. I abandoned the idea to install a GPS it somewhere in the boat for the reasons that were clearly explained in other comments. I aso think that the mobile solution has other faults (slow reaction, difficult to manage with plastic covers, consume of batteries, readibility of the screen).
At last i chose to use my handeld Garmin Dakota that i bought for hiking but it has also some functions for boating. I use it withouth a waterproof cover, unless i am sailing fast upwind with waves. it is sold just as spash resistant. not at all waterproof.
in june i had a good surprise. I capsized with a dinghy, the waterproof puch with the dakota was not closed properly and it was completely underwater for 2 hours. I though it was lost but surprisingly it wasnt. and i am still using it without any problem.
of course i dont suggest u to do the same but at least think that when they say it's spashproof this is real and u can easily keep it in your hand or the pocket of your jacket even if it is wet.
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